A real problem

[Tank]

Well I woke up this morning and I just feel like rambling, so here goes. I was watching a documentry last night about "Global DImming" For some of you that do not know I will elaborate. Global Dimming is effectively what it says, less sunlight is reaching our earth. Just like Global Warming, it is all, our fault. Now you would get people that say, well that is good, less sunlight means we do not have to worry about global warming right? Wrong. It actually only amplifies the problem. Now with all of our pollution in the air, greenhouse gases and everything we have done as humans, it only makes matters worse. You see rain drops, form in the clouds. Clouds are effectively, just big fluffy packs of molecules and water. Well the rain drops find a molecule in a cloud, and start to form on it. Now normally, in a few parts of the world, where pollution is much lower then countries with money and power, there rainfall and temperatures are not so dramatic as ours. But all of our greenhouse gases, get trapped in these clouds. They pose as molecules in the clouds. So now, you have 10 times more molecules, in the clouds, as there should be. So now instead of having a few big molecules, where big raindrops can form, you now have, a very very large amount of small molecules which produce very small rain drops. Now anyone will say "ok so what, our rain is decreasing in size, so what? Well now, our clouds are just mirrors, big mirrors in the sky. A few big raindrops, reflect less light then alot of little ones. So the sun is hitting the clouds, and bouncing back into space. So we are effectively getting less sunlight. A 10% decrease in sunlight in the United States has been measured. Now some will still say, less sunlight is good, that, is wrong.

We are effectively cooking ourselves with the way the world is going. Of course we don't think about it when we wake up in the morning, grab a shower and a cup of coffee and check our e-mails. But how many times do you see a Dodge Crew Cab going down the freeway with 35 inch mud king tires and it gets 12 MPG, but yet there is only one person in it. One person, he has no big load he needs to carry, or any reason for driving that monsterous pickup for his daily driver, he just wants to look cool. Picture the world, as one big room, just a big bedroom with no furniture, nothing, no windows. Four walls, no door, nothing, just four walls. Ok, now put all of the worlds population inside of it, so let's just say for a number sake, 6,000,000,000. Now, take every vehiclke, factory, generator, whatever, that produces any type of greenhouse gas, and place it in that room with you. Now go ahead, and turn all those machines on, and wait. That is what we are doing. The ozone layer, is trapping our exhaust gases, in the earth with us. So we are only heating up ourselves. We ARE, effectively roasting ourselves to death. It is all a matter of time really.

We are suppose to be the most intelligent species ever. We have alot of high tech gadgets, cool cell phones, insanely fast laptops, smart cars, all that stuff. But we still use the same manufacturering process, as was used 40 years ago. Oil, Gas, Diesel, Propane, Natural Gas, you name it, factories are still using it to generate all our matrerials. We are so intelligent but yet we have been using the same means of fuel for the last 100 years?! Gas has been around since when the early 1900's? Diesel was in the early 1900's too. We are so intelligent that we cannot even figure out another way to get around, or to survive?? No, we ARE intelligent enough, of that, I have no doubt. But it is a brutal matter of who cares, and who does not. Everyone MUST care, in order to be able to fix it. People do not want to stop driving in Cadillac Escalades with 29 inch rims and Chips in there engines to increase HP and torque, all those chips do is tell the computer to change the fuel injector timing and thus, throw more fuel in. But no no no wait a minute. If I do not drive around on dubs, or 35 inch mud kings with my crew cab dodge, I am not cool, forget that, I would rather cook myself. That is what people would say. The world is materialistic people. We want our SUV's, our Corvettes, our factories that produce our coolermaster stacker cases, our LED case fans. But everything we have is made from a process that is killing us, slowly, but definitly, 100% forsure, it is.

That's all I have to say, please, share your feelings and opinons. Let's hear it.

[liljim]

Interesting topic, its been a while since we've had such a discussion.

I'll start by saying im one of the big gas drinking SUV owners with 20" wheels and all the bells and whistles. I have the performance programmer installed and a cold air intake system for a dramatic HP increase. With that said, i burn much less fuel than i did with the stock setup.
I do think that a few advancements have been made in fuel economy and even other fuel resources but i dont think its being done as fast as it could be. We have a small fleet of hybred cars avaliable now (half gas/half elec.) and hydrogen vehicles are slowly being developed. Chevy has SUV's (2007 tahoe for sure) that feature 8 cylinder engines that are capable of running on 4 cylinders when 8 isnt needed and also run on gas & E85 fuel.
Just for clarity, is a mixture of 85% Ethanol and 15% gas. This mixture greatly reduces emissions produced by vehicles.
In the next few years, i really think we'll start to see vehicles change for the same reasons Tank mentioned but the affordability will always be an issue. The major set back in the evolution of enviromental awareness is not with average citizens driving big vehicles, its with manufactors/developers wanting to be billionaires. Everything comes down to money. We more than have the technology to produce better vehicles, industrial facilities and everything else that's not enviromental friendly but again, the average person cant afford it.
Arnold schwarzenegger owns a , that says in itself that an average person wont afford it for a good 20 years from now.
Maybe we'll eventually get a US president thats more concerned with US economy and well being than foriegn economy. Thats going to be our first step in contributing to the concerns of global restoration. Give us an economy where we can afford the products avaliable.

[Tank]

But, on that note, Ethanol, AND hydrogen, take fossil fuels to produce, and alot of them. Both of these "alternative fuels" could never be produced dramatically enough, to rid of even 50% use of fossil fuels. It takes alot of fossil fuel to make Hydrogen and Ethanol.

It has been determinded, that by 2025, Global Warming will be irreverseable. So if we do not act now, we are dooming ourselves and the next generation. It is only 19 years away folks. That may seem long, but it definitly is not.

What you say about Government and Industry is very true. The governments want us to keep using fossil fuel. It is a cheap fuel to produe in terms of comparison to hydrogen or ethanol, and so for them, they do not care about the climate, and they do not realize, while they go home to there $500,000 mansion on a quiet street in there H3, they are in fact, committing suicide. They are killing themselves slowly. And us as well.

[Gecko]

It is not the government that what us to keep using fossil fuels it big oil companies. Through their good-old-boy campaign funding and back scratching they do weald a large control of both houses and currently the presidential office. These politicians achieved their elected positions through special interest campaign financing and targeted lobbying. If they want to have a successful re-election campaign then they have to support those lobbyist and special interest group issues and interests.

That is why we are so fossil fuel dependent, that is why we are in Iraq and that is why tax relief is designed for the wealthy.

We already have a number of renewable energy resources that are being further developed such as wind energy, solar power, even electricity generated from ocean waves. The drawback for these types of resources is the kilowatt hour per dollar investment ratio. Trust me when it becomes cheaper to build a solar farm than it does to drill for oil then the big oil companies will be the first ones to build them.

I believe that social change start with oneself, I have solar heaters for both my hot water and the pool. I drive a motorcycle most every where I go unless it raining or more than one is going. I have insulated my attic, coated my windows, sealed my doors and windows and installed a gable fan, my house is energy efficient.

As for changes on the political level, I believe that under the current campaign financing laws, in order to achieve a political position high enough to affect real change you would have to go against the moral and social values that drove you to seek the changes in the first place.

[Tank]

Ok so basically, if they do not support the oil companies, then they won't get elected, so either they hop on the band wagon, or get lost, and they definitly won't chose option B. The War in Iraq is senseless. It is casuing our world to collapse even faster. But let's not get off the main issue here. The renewable energy sources right now simply are not enough. We need to completely stop pollution or decrease it by about 80%, if we have any hope of surviving for more then another 50 years. The problem with big companies and cost management, is that they think of the "now" investment. Now let's compare this. You get a big company, needs to buy a light bulb. So they go to the store, they weigh there options. Now you have your traditional bulb that lasts, lets say, 1000 hours, it's $2, again, just using this as an example. But then you could get a coiled one thats fluroscent, it lasts 5000 hours, but costs $6. The big companies will go for the $2 bulb, because right now, they spend $2. Even though, to get the equilvelant amount of light time out of bulb 1, will cost them $10, as opposed to $6 for that other bulb. But because at that very moment and time it is cheaper, they will go that route.

It really is a shame because when it IS to late, and we cannot do anything, then those people WILL be sorry, and I hope they realize that it was there communist and political thinking that did it. Money IS the root of all evil.

I see us heading back to the horse and carrage days, everyone either farmed or owned a store. No motor vehicles, no pollution, and if there were machines, very little were powered by a fuel.

Social change is a whole other kettle of fish. If you went out and asked 1000 people on the streets if they would cut down or give up a luxury to save resources, I bet you 600 to 800 people would not do it. They are spolied and figure nothing is wrong with the earth. That stems back to the company and the light bulb.

People today figure, hell, nothing is wrong today?? Today isnt the day global warming will kill us, or global storms will erupt because of global warming, and people say "why worry about it until it gets here" thats only true for thigns liek going to the dentist. If we do not start to worry now, we won't have to worry much longer, because the brutal truth is, we are heading back to the stone age, world will burn up, and history does repeat itself.

The greatest enemy to humans, is humanity.

[venney]

Well I must say this is an interesting post.
I have many opinions about many of these topics.
But firstly, I shall explain the theory of Gia, or at least what if remember of the theory.

The theory states that the world can heal its self, or at least 'fix' its self, or change to suit.
For example, when it rains the water seeps into the ground, draining minerals and salts from the earth into the sea/rivers etc. So, the salts and minerals are being taken into the sea, and yet the salt level of the sea stays constant. Which it shouldn’t do, but it does (I believe).
It is quite hard for me to talk about this because it was a while ago I learned about it, but if the theory is correct, the earth will heal/adapt/change in order to survive global warming.
We are thinking about this very selfishly. If we do die, maybe that’s the next stage. Maybe humans are stopping further creatures from developing. The dinosaurs didn’t have much choice, they all died out, we are here now. Even if the world is too hot for anything to survive, that could just be the cycle continuing, everything has to come to an end.

I am more worried about us humans killing each other, or blowing up countries than global warming as it stands.
It’s only a matter of time before you get some nut-ball who decides to take out a country.

The other thing that ticks me off is how hypocritical we can all be. What I mean here is in England, our country used to be covered in forest, full of wild bore. We cut down our forests, preserve a short few. We hunt all our bore, we drive it from out country. And then we sit back and tell countries like Brazil that they 'shouldn’t' be cutting down their forests, or certain animals are becoming endangered. Its fine when Henry the 8th hunts animals, and yet hunting is being banned now?
All these sorts of things are very annoying. Don’t get me wrong, of course I'm not condoning hunting, extinction of animals or cutting down rain forests, I am merely stating my point.

Like gecko said about his house being energy efficient, that’s the sort of thing everyone needs to start doing. If everyone cut back on the amount of gas they used into here homes for heating we would not be in this situation. Cars only add to the problem.
I personally would not like an electrical car. I like my car, it doesn’t eat petrol, and it’s a small 1.2. American cars have 3 litre engines. Yes that is causing problems. But, who am I to tell someone else to stop using their car. If you told me to stop using my car what would I say?
We do have a problem but we cannot force electrical cars on people.

Smoking is another thing. I dislike it when I am down the pub and I am eating food and someone is smoking. Not only is it ruining my atmosphere but it is also hurting my body.
I could politely ask them to stop smoking, but they don’t have to.

There are many problems in the world.
We can only change ourselves, and make others aware. There is no point in forcing opinions on people, making people do things. If people change for them self’s, the companies will change.

A good example of this would be mc Donnalds, or CocaCola. Mc donnalds are scared of loosing business so they are changing to meet the consumer demands, salads, fruit, smoovies. CocaCola now have this sugar free Coke. If everyone stops buying normal coke, CocaCola would not exist.

Venney

[Tank]

Very good post Venney. In the beginning, you said the world will adapt, or at least, that is what people say. Maybe, maybe I am crazy for thinking us. But what if the picture is just a little bigger then we think?? The real threat to humans, as I said, is humanity. We as humans are the greatest single threat to our own lives and our world and way of living. Take President Bush for example....what in the hell is that boy doing?? He is destroying the world. Maybe he is only in Iraq because he wants to take over all there oil and make it U.S owned, cheaper for him. We have alot of problems, people are bringing children into this world like wild fire, and we are running out of resources here.

As far as the hypocritical thing, I agree 100% there too. Countries and Governments do one thing, and then turn around tell someone else not to, EXACTLY, what they just did themselves.

Unequal treatment, I have to bring this up, even though it is getting off the topic of global warming/pollution. So many people think, that they are better then others. I drive Truck for a living, I work extremely hard, 14 to 18 hours a day, 350 days of the year, and I do not make NEAR, the money I should. Put it this way, if I got paid by the hour, I would be laughing! But who is to say that some big time government official is any better of a person then I am? Our brains were designed and made, the exact same way. He is absolutely no different then me, or any other human being. He was not designed in his moms belly to become some "super human" he is just a normal humna being. But what does those types do?? They let there jobs go to there heads, and soon they treat anyone who is of a lower job posting then them, like crap. They look at there friends in terms of there salaries, not personalities. I only have a grade 12 diploma, and I do not have any plans to go to secondary. You put me and a college professor side by side. He will read something much more serious then I, he will know things I don't. But I will read things differently, and I in turn, will know things he does not. We are all smart, but in our own ways and areas. But nope, not in this world, in this day and age, if your not educated and make a six figure salary, forget about you.

So then when a country thinks about who to go to war with, they figure "oh thats ok, those people are all uneducated and dont have good jobs, kill them" umm, excuse you, but who just gave you gods seat to sit in?? What makes you think you have the right to decide when someones life ends??

Change will come from within. I try and be as helpful as I can to everyone I know. I have clocked out at work, and stayed behind for an hour out of my own time, to help a driver hook his trailers together. I see someone on the side of the road pulled over who looks in desperate need of help, I will pull over and try my hardest to get them on there way safely. Life is not about money and cars, it is about exactly one thing, life in itself.

Now as far as cars go, some people will always buy the newest most fuel efficient, and thats good, and some won't, what can you do, you cannot force people.

Smoking, now there is a whole friggin kettle of fish eh people? lol. I do agree with Venney, nothing ruins your meal more then when you go to take a bite out of that big juicy steak with BBQ sauce.....yumm and soem guy blows his cigarette smoke your way. We cannot force those people to stop, we are not asking you to. We are just saying have some respect and dignity, be a man, not a child.

I find that is the problem alot these days, alot of guys out there figure they are pretty big men, lipping off to woman and cutting everyone off in traffic and such cowardly acts, stand up to what you do like a man, be a fricken man for once! Admit to your mistakes swiftly and quickly, and fix them. If even that could be accomplished, that one thing, imagine the world with honesty....nice isnt it?

[Gecko]

[venney]

[Tank]

[Gecko]

venney,

No one likes to be ordered around myself included, yes I'll be the first one to jump when I'm ordered to not jump.
In a work environment barking orders may get the task done at the moment but the employee will resent doing that task and will only do the bare minimum. If the same employee is asked in a way that makes him/her feel included and appreciated then the task will get done faster and with their best effort.

I suspect that you are experiencing the first hand affects of the "Peter Principal" The theory is that an employee will raise to his/her level of incompetence and no farther.
That person will be forever passed over on any promotion possibility and explains why ordering subordinates is their only way to feel superior. (see school yard bully above)

The junk yard dog approach to labor management is on its way out in any corporate environment. The approach does not yield the best product throughput, employee attendance or bottom line, besides the liability of harassment lawsuits is not worth it.

I do understand your frustration but it is all part of the business world and what you have to endure to move ahead. I have quite more than one job after telling the boss what I really thought of him and his antiquated beliefs and methods of management. I'll tell you it felt good to have my say and walk out the door knowing I had kept my morals and values intact by leaving and that I would start a new job the next week.

[Tank]

That in itself is a new kettle of fish too. I have seen alot of bosses and dispatchers, try to control there drivers. They demand, instead of asking.

If they would just ask and give some incentive or something, then people would be alot more willing to get the job done, and they would do the job correctly.